Question
Hi folks!
Would anyone be able to tell whether $6300 is a fair price for full body package lhr with light sheer diode XC. The consultant tells me with my skin type (which is 6 per their chart, but from all that I have read I think its 4. I am Asian Indian with light skin) it might take 12 - 15 treatments for the areas that are exposed to the sun, and this place has a two yr warranty after 6 treatments.
Thanks very much.

Answer
Hi folks!
Would anyone be able to tell whether $6300 is a fair price for full body package lhr with light sheer diode XC. The consultant tells me with my skin type (which is 6 per their chart, but from all that I have read I think its 4. I am Asian Indian with light skin) it might take 12 - 15 treatments for the areas that are exposed to the sun, and this place has a two yr warranty after 6 treatments.
Thanks very much.

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this sounds like a standard quote from a popular chain clinic. it's an ok price for 12-15 treatments if they're ready to give you that many. if you're any darker than a type IV though, LightSheer will have to be used on too low of settings to actually kill most of the hair. so, that's somehting that you should figure out first. Have at least 2-3 consultations and see what other places say in terms of how dark you are and what laser is best. If you're darker than a type IV, a Yag laser will be better for u.

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I know prices vary depending on the place but to me this seems like a good price. I wasn't clear on exactly how many treatments you were getting for that price though, 6? 12? 15? My package was for 6 treatments of full leg and full arms for about $4500 CDN (incl. GST tax) so yours seems good.
I am also Indian with skin type IV and I'm using the LightSheer diode laser. Only one treatment so far but I'm happy with what I've seen. If you're type VI though this may not be the right laser for you.

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The quote was for 6 treatments plus any number needed in the two years following (not sure about tax ). The consultant said I might need 12 - 15 treatments for face areas. Any treatments within 2 years of the 6th treatment would be included. Since face scheduling is 4-6 wks, that is plenty of time to get all the treatments I might need. Just real worried about stimulating new growth, its one of the reasons I am confused.
I am fairly light brown skinned ('fair' in Indian terms, you know), I am slightly anaemic so I am pale, except for arms since they tan in sun. From all I have read, I am a type 4, but I scored high on their questionnaire because of heritage (if you have both Indian parents just that gets you a score of 10). Even the consultant did not think I was a six.
I have read a lot on this site, hairtell and all the links that are offered between these forums and find that different sites say different things. I am concerned about effectiveness, price as well as skin damage. I have sensitive skin, and lots of areas to treat, some with dark coarse hair and some with fine dark hair.
Light sheer may be effective for me, but the test spot they did was just 16 J and it felt like a mild pinch, I think I can go up to 20 or 24 J but am not confident about much higher. I read here that below 30 J its not that effective. Also some sites say light sheer can burn darker skins easier, and some sites on YAG say that there is higher discomfort as compared to lightsheer.
So should I take my chances with this good price for all these areas I want, and perhaps get permanent miniaturization (that seems like best case possibility long term), or should I go with YAG and pretty much get the areas with the coarse hairs out and then just live with all the fine hairs. Even this would cost much more than the package I am being quoted.
but, ..... if lightsheer works for me, I have a chance to really improve my quality of life. As you can tell I am confused....
Thanks for listening. Do keep updating your results with lightsheer.


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if the highest settings they can safely use on you is 24 joules max, i wouldn't waste time with Lightsheer. That means you need a Yag. With Lightsheer, that would mean you will reach diminishing returns really fast. finer hairs won't really be affected with LightSheer with such low settings either. When they say LightSheer can work on finer hair better than the Yags, they mean that high settings on LightSheer can kill those hairs better, i.e. 40 joules and up. If you can't do at leat 30-35 joules, I would just go with the Yag to begin with. You can use Yag safely on your skin at high settings without damaging your skin. And it might work on finer hair as well at high settings, just not as good as LightSheer at high settings, but you can't use Lightsheer on those settings anyways as that will damage your skin.

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Blink888 has more experience then me but I'll throw in my 1 cents' worth. I am also a fair skinned Indian (probably the same as you) and ended up being a IV (both parents are Indian). I wouldn't consider my skin sensitive in general but I do burn from my face to shoulders if I don't use enough sunscreen. I also get more freckles on my face if I spend a lot of time in the sun. My arms and legs just tan, I've never burned them.
On my legs and arms they set it at 30 joules but I'm not sure if it would have been the same for my face. They also said that they would increase the setting by a few joules the next time.
I honestly don't know what the best solution would be for you but I share in your confusion about what to choose. I felt the same way when I was trying to decide. Blink888 has good advice as always. The LightSheer may not be worth it if that's the highest setting they can go for you. Would they give you a test patch at a higher setting?
Good luck and keep us posted!

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Hi blink888!
Is this opinion based on some research that lower joule settings will not work to kill hair on type 4? the two nurses I spoke with said that lower settings do kill hair, just not as much. I will get results but I have to be realistic. They will have to keep the diode at low settings so as not to burn my skin, and its true that less energy may not kill as many hairs, but that it does kill some hairs, and if there is many treatments (which I can get with the 2 yr coverage), eventually, I will see significant reduction. Perhaps not the 85%, but I would be ok with 70-75%.
Also that the YAG is definitely gentler and there would be no complications of scabbing or hyperpigmentation, but that its a much slower process with YAG (on type 4) and people can get frustrated or run out of budgets due to all the treatments they might need with that.
The problem is that I have not been able to find any YAG place that I liked enough to go consult (I am in San Diego), or they would end up being two or three times the total cost if I had to go for as many treatments as 12-15. Most places I call are using the Lightsheer.
I really appreciate all the helpful people on this board. I wish there were some type 4 Indian people who could provide their success or failure stories with the lightsheer versus the YAG, it would help so much.

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Hi vml!
I will be going again today and asking for a test spot with higher setting, lets see how high they might be willing to go and what I can tolerate.
I am really looking forward to hearing your experience. I have become obsessed with this thing now, just because there is this hope that perhaps I can be one of the fortunate ones that do get success.

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hert9, I totally understand your obsession! I would to be hair free or even to have less or finer hair! I'm not sure how I find the time but I spend a lot of my time researching this topic on the internet and reading peoples experiences. Hopefully more Indian type IV people will come out and post

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if you understand how lasers work, it is very obvious why low settings just don't do it. low settings can kill a small percentage of hair, but for most of it, it will just damage it a bit and make the hair come in finer, but still come back. it's something that has been noticed by those doing laser hair removal for a long time as you have probably already read on all these forums. one thing i would recommend you do is not fully believe anyone who you are paying for treatments (especially just a salaried nurse who has no invested interest in your results or the business she's working for) on what settings will work or not work. there is also a various definition of what "work" means. temporary reduction where hair will come back finer and will be even harder to get rid of with laser (since it will have less pigment now) is probably not your ideal result you are looking for. from years of experience of professionals on these unbiased boards (since noone has invested interest in you using their laser or center here), it is obvious that the best results are achieved through the most aggressive treatments in terms of settings. using highest settings your skin can handle is very important for permanently killing the hair (especially true on a woman's face).
Like L.E. says here, I'll repeat. I'd rather be treated with a Yag by a very experienced tech, rather than with a diode (like LightSheer) or alexandrite by someone who's not that experienced and knowledgeable. The experience and knowledge of how to use the highest settings your skin can safely handle is very important in achieve great results and that's what you should be looking for. There are many people who got great results with a Yag. It doesn't necessarily take longer. That is usually said about someone who has very light skin and choosing between 2 experienced techs with either a Yag or a LightSheer. In that case, LightSheer would probably be a wiser choice, given everything else is same. In your case, Yag would probably be a wiser choice because low settings can not only not give you poor results, but can actually stimulate more growth. I hate seeing those posts. It usually happens from ultra conservatives techs who are not confident (and experienced) enough to try higher settings. So they do what's "safe", which is not in your best interests.
There are many clinics in SD. I doubt you won't be able to find at least several places with a Yag. I know for a fact there are several people on the hair-tel forum in SD using the new Comet and a Yag. To find practitioners in that area, you can either use the search feature on all these forums or you can go directly to Candela (GentleYag manufacturer) or Cutera (Coolglide) websites and run a provider search. Sciton Yag is also a good Yag laser with scanning technology that makes it easier not to miss any spots.
Like vml said, you could also have them do a few test spots to see how high of settings you can handle, but if it's anything under 30-35, I would definitely go with a Yag. For your skin and hair type, it will not take any more treatments than a Lightsheer at low settings, but will produce better results because high settings can be used.
good luck.

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Lowering the joules on dark skin with an alexandrite or a diode is a waste of time and money. You are only stunning the hair. And possibly stimulating it into defending the injury and becoming a coarser hair or producing new growth. Before YAGs were perfected, we were told in training seminars for alexandrites and diodes that dark skin clients would never see permanent results because of the low energy needed to protect the skin.
Anyone that tells you that you will get results using lower joules only sees dollar signs.

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Thanks so very much for all the input. I went in yesterday, they tried 19J and my skin got a little pink at the time and after about 30 - 45 min it was back to normal. I asked about raising the fluence and she basically said for my skin they would have to start out under 20J, because the hairs are coarse and that raises the risk of burning.
So at the risk of trying your patience, if they start under 20J and get the hair to be fine, and then raise the energy up to 30, does that have a high probability of working?
I am going to look up the YAG manufacturers for practices in SD now. Thank you again.

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no, it doesn't. anything under 30 on LightSheer is a waste. You will be going for dozens of treatments this way with lots of money spent and no guarantee on results. The best and most cost-effective way to tackle this is to start out at high joules right away and kill the hair the first time around. Fine hair is a lot harder to kill and almost impossible sometimes on darker skin.

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Even though they're offering you a great price deal it may not be worth it. Have you gone to any other LHR places? Even others using a LightSheer diode may give you a higher joules spot test.

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So I looked up two places that I found off the Cutera site that use Coolglide, thx for the suggestion blink888.
The first has 3 nurses, they have been nurses for a long time but lhr experience is between 1 and 2 yrs. 2 of the nurses co-own this small dayspa with a plastic surgeon. They gave me a test spot on my forearm, just two shots, at 50 J and 30ms. It hurt and I got the little red bumps and skin was red and then pink, returned to normal after 48 hrs. They apply the gel beforehand, don't think they ice, and don't apply any aloe after. Is that imp?
Second place, I talked to one guy, he seemed really experienced and knowledgeable, but I just did not feel comfortable at a personal level. He gave me a test spot at 55J and 25ms. It hurt more, and I got the red bumps, again almost normal in 48 hrs. This places ices beforehand. Not sure about any after gel..
So I am thinking I will do one area with the first place and assess results and technique.... though I have nothing to compare it with. If hair regrow, either setting is too low or hair was not in anagen, right. The latter should not be a factor after 4th treatment or so, the practitioner should be able to tell what is a good setting. Perhaps I will go back and ask for one or two more test spots at higher settings before I begin.
hert9